Pope Francis contradicts the Vatican Congregation for the Clergy

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Pope Francis contradicts the Vatican Congregation for the Clergy

Post by Lionel A on Sat May 04, 2013 10:06 am

Friday, May 3, 2013
Pope Francis contradicts the Vatican Congregation for the Clergy

Pope Francis contradicts the Vatican Coungregation for the Clergy.(1) Pope Francis has said that it is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church. He was referring not to church in general, including other Christian communities and churches, but to the "hierarchical and Catholic" church of St.Ignatius of Loyola. He quoted the great pope, Pope Paul VI who said, "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy."

He is contradicting the Vatican website for clergy (clerus.org) which has a lengthy report in Italian by Father Alberto Sartori, President of the Commission for the Clergy in which he rejects the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus. He claims the Magisterium condemned Fr.Leonard Feeney for his 'rigorist interpretation' of the dogma.

Fr.Sartori,the Director of the Interdiocesan Theological School of Formation,Italy states that Pope Pius XII in Mystici Corporis said there can be non Catholics saved who are not members of the Catholic Church visibly and who could be saved with a baptism of desire.Don Sartori assumes that we know these cases explicitly and so they contradict the text of the dogma which indicates every one needs to be a visible member of the Church for salvation. He believes since these cases are explicit they also contradict Fr.Leonard Feeney of Boston. Mystici Corporis or the Letter of the Holy Office does not claim that these are explicitly known.It has been known for centuries that these are implicit cases and so do not contradict the dogma extra ecclesiam nulla salus.So for him there are execptions but there are no exceptions for Pope Francis.

When Pope Francis quoted Pope Paul VI who said, "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy", the Jesuit pope is saying that membership in the "hierarchical and Catholic" was necessary for salvation for all.-Lionel Andrades

Don Sartori who lives at the seminary in Vittorio Veneto(TV), is an assistant parish priest in the diocese Farra di Soligo.He states on the website that the Archbishop of Boston Cardinal Cushing asked the Holy Office (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith,Vatican) to intervene in the Fr.Leonard Feeney case. The Holy Office affirmed the importance of the axiom he says and condemned the interpretation that rejected those saved with the baptism of desire or in invincible ignorance.In other words there were known exceptions to the interpretation of Fr.Leonard Feeney. Fr.Leonard Feeney like Pope Francis is saying all can know Jesus and be saved in only the Catholic Church. Implicit desire etc are irrelevant to this issue since they are known only to God.-Lionel Andrades

Video:
https://youtu.be/Jed_7aRz0Gk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jed_7aRz0Gk

“It is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church”-Pope Francis

Pope: Mass on Feast of St. George
2013-04-23 Vatican Radio

(Vatican Radio) “It is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church”: this was Pope Francis’ message as he marked his name day, the Feast of St. George, this Tuesday celebrating Mass in the Pauline Chapel with the Cardinals present in Rome. Emer McCarthy reports:

In his homily, the Pope thanked the cardinals for coming to concelebrate with him: "Thank you - he said - because I really feel welcomed by you". Commenting on the readings of the day, the Holy Father highlighted three aspects of the Church: Its missionary activity, born of persecution; the fact that it is a Mother Church which gifts us the faith that is our identity and that you cannot find Jesus outside of the Church; the joy of belonging to the Church bringing Jesus to others. In short the joy of being an evangelizer:

Below we publish a Vatican Radio transcript and translation of the Holy Father’s Homily for Mass with the Cardinals in the Pauline Chapel.

I thank His Eminence, the Cardinal Dean, for his words: thank you very much, Your Eminence, thank you.

I also thank all of you who wanted to come today: Thank you. Because I feel welcomed by you. Thank you. I feel good with you, and I like that.

The [first] reading today makes me think that the missionary expansion of the Church began precisely at a time of persecution, and these Christians went as far as Phoenicia, Cyprus and Antioch, and proclaimed the Word. They had this apostolic fervor within them, and that is how the faith spread! Some, people of Cyprus and Cyrene - not these, but others who had become Christians - went to Antioch and began to speak to the Greeks too. It was a further step. And this is how the Church moved forward. Whose was this initiative to speak to the Greeks? This was not clear to anyone but the Jews. But ... it was the Holy Spirit, the One who prompted them ever forward ... But some in Jerusalem, when they heard this, became 'nervous and sent Barnabas on an "apostolic visitation": perhaps, with a little sense of humor we could say that this was the theological beginning of the Doctrine of the Faith: this apostolic visit by Barnabas. He saw, and he saw that things were going well.

And so the Church was a Mother, the Mother of more children, of many children. It became more and more of a Mother. A Mother who gives us the faith, a Mother who gives us an identity. But the Christian identity is not an identity card: Christian identity is belonging to the Church, because all of these belonged to the Church, the Mother Church. Because it is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church. The great Paul VI said: "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy." And the Mother Church that gives us Jesus gives us our identity that is not only a seal, it is a belonging. Identity means belonging. This belonging to the Church is beautiful.

And the third idea comes to my mind - the first was the explosion of missionary activity; the second, the Mother Church - and the third, that when Barnabas saw that crowd - the text says: " And a large number of people was added to the Lord" - when he saw those crowds, he experienced joy. " When he arrived and saw the grace of God, he rejoiced ": his is the joy of the evangelizer. It was, as Paul VI said, "the sweet and comforting joy of evangelizing." And this joy begins with a persecution, with great sadness, and ends with joy. And so the Church goes forward, as one Saint says - I do not remember which one, here - "amid the persecutions of the world and the consolations of the Lord." And thus is the life of the Church. If we want to travel a little along the road of worldliness, negotiating with the world - as did the Maccabees, who were tempted, at that time - we will never have the consolation of the Lord. And if we seek only consolation, it will be a superficial consolation, not that of the Lord: a human consolation. The Church's journey always takes place between the Cross and the Resurrection, amid the persecutions and the consolations of the Lord. And this is the path: those who go down this road are not mistaken.

Let us think today about the missionary activity of the Church: these [people] came out of themselves to go forth. Even those who had the courage to proclaim Jesus to the Greeks, an almost scandalous thing at that time. Think of this Mother Church that grows, grows with new children to whom She gives the identity of the faith, because you cannot believe in Jesus without the Church. Jesus Himself says in the Gospel: " But you do not believe, because you are not among my sheep." If we are not "sheep of Jesus," faith does not some to us. It is a rosewater faith, a faith without substance. And let us think of the consolation that Barnabas felt, which is "the sweet and comforting joy of evangelizing." And let us ask the Lord for this "parresia", this apostolic fervor that impels us to move forward, as brothers, all of us forward! Forward, bringing the name of Jesus in the bosom of Holy Mother Church, and, as St. Ignatius said, "hierarchical and Catholic." So be it.
http://www.news.va/en/news/pope-mass-on-feast-of-st-george-full-text


1.
www.clerus.org/clerus/dati/1999-03/24-2/Teologiaeligioni.rtf.html

Vatican website for clergy promotes 'theology of religions', Kung and Knitter : claims Fr.Leonard Feeney was excommunicated for the same interpretation of the dogma as the popes and saints
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2011/10/vatican-webste-for-clergy-promotes.html
Pope Francis’ feast of St.George statement contradicts the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2013/05/pope-francis-feast-of-stgeorge.html#links
Posted by Catholic Mission at 1:54 PM No comments: Links to this post
Labels: Congregation for the Clergy Vatican, Pope Francis
Thursday, May 2, 2013
Pope Francis contradicts Cardinal Kurt Koch

Pope Francis contradicts Cardinal Kurt Koch, President of the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity and relations with the Jews. Pope Francis has said that it is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church. He was referring not to church in general, including other Christian communities and churches, but to the "hierarchical and Catholic" church of St.Ignatius of Loyola. He quoted the great pope, Pope Paul VI who said, "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy."

He is contradicting Cardinal Kurt Koch’s understanding of ecumenism and also the need for Jews to convert into the Church for salvation.

Last May Cardinal Kurt Koch said:While Catholics profess that, in the end, all salvation will be accomplished through Jesus Christ, “it does not necessarily follow that the Jews are excluded from God’s salvation because they do not believe in Jesus Christ as the Messiah of Israel and the son of God,” the cardinal said. “That the Jews are participants in God’s salvation is theologically unquestionable, but how that can be possible without confessing Christ explicitly is and remains an unfathomable divine mystery.”
The pope has solved Cardinal Kurt Koch’s ‘unfathomable divine mystery’. He is saying that it necessarily follows that the Jews will be excluded from God’s salvation if they do not believe in Jesus Christ within the Catholic Church.

When Pope Francis quoted Pope Paul VI who said, "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy", the Jesuit pope is saying that membership in the "hierarchical and Catholic" was necessary for Jews and Christians, for salvation.-Lionel Andrades


Video:
https://youtu.be/Jed_7aRz0Gk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jed_7aRz0Gk


“It is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church”-Pope Francis


Pope: Mass on Feast of St. George
2013-04-23 Vatican Radio


(Vatican Radio) “It is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church”: this was Pope Francis’ message as he marked his name day, the Feast of St. George, this Tuesday celebrating Mass in the Pauline Chapel with the Cardinals present in Rome. Emer McCarthy reports:


In his homily, the Pope thanked the cardinals for coming to concelebrate with him: "Thank you - he said - because I really feel welcomed by you". Commenting on the readings of the day, the Holy Father highlighted three aspects of the Church: Its missionary activity, born of persecution; the fact that it is a Mother Church which gifts us the faith that is our identity and that you cannot find Jesus outside of the Church; the joy of belonging to the Church bringing Jesus to others. In short the joy of being an evangelizer:


Below we publish a Vatican Radio transcript and translation of the Holy Father’s Homily for Mass with the Cardinals in the Pauline Chapel.


I thank His Eminence, the Cardinal Dean, for his words: thank you very much, Your Eminence, thank you.


I also thank all of you who wanted to come today: Thank you. Because I feel welcomed by you. Thank you. I feel good with you, and I like that.


The [first] reading today makes me think that the missionary expansion of the Church began precisely at a time of persecution, and these Christians went as far as Phoenicia, Cyprus and Antioch, and proclaimed the Word. They had this apostolic fervor within them, and that is how the faith spread! Some, people of Cyprus and Cyrene - not these, but others who had become Christians - went to Antioch and began to speak to the Greeks too. It was a further step. And this is how the Church moved forward. Whose was this initiative to speak to the Greeks? This was not clear to anyone but the Jews. But ... it was the Holy Spirit, the One who prompted them ever forward ... But some in Jerusalem, when they heard this, became 'nervous and sent Barnabas on an "apostolic visitation": perhaps, with a little sense of humor we could say that this was the theological beginning of the Doctrine of the Faith: this apostolic visit by Barnabas. He saw, and he saw that things were going well.


And so the Church was a Mother, the Mother of more children, of many children. It became more and more of a Mother. A Mother who gives us the faith, a Mother who gives us an identity. But the Christian identity is not an identity card: Christian identity is belonging to the Church, because all of these belonged to the Church, the Mother Church. Because it is not possible to find Jesus outside the Church. The great Paul VI said: "Wanting to live with Jesus without the Church, following Jesus outside of the Church, loving Jesus without the Church is an absurd dichotomy." And the Mother Church that gives us Jesus gives us our identity that is not only a seal, it is a belonging. Identity means belonging. This belonging to the Church is beautiful.


And the third idea comes to my mind - the first was the explosion of missionary activity; the second, the Mother Church - and the third, that when Barnabas saw that crowd - the text says: " And a large number of people was added to the Lord" - when he saw those crowds, he experienced joy. " When he arrived and saw the grace of God, he rejoiced ": his is the joy of the evangelizer. It was, as Paul VI said, "the sweet and comforting joy of evangelizing." And this joy begins with a persecution, with great sadness, and ends with joy. And so the Church goes forward, as one Saint says - I do not remember which one, here - "amid the persecutions of the world and the consolations of the Lord." And thus is the life of the Church. If we want to travel a little along the road of worldliness, negotiating with the world - as did the Maccabees, who were tempted, at that time - we will never have the consolation of the Lord. And if we seek only consolation, it will be a superficial consolation, not that of the Lord: a human consolation. The Church's journey always takes place between the Cross and the Resurrection, amid the persecutions and the consolations of the Lord. And this is the path: those who go down this road are not mistaken.


Let us think today about the missionary activity of the Church: these [people] came out of themselves to go forth. Even those who had the courage to proclaim Jesus to the Greeks, an almost scandalous thing at that time. Think of this Mother Church that grows, grows with new children to whom She gives the identity of the faith, because you cannot believe in Jesus without the Church. Jesus Himself says in the Gospel: " But you do not believe, because you are not among my sheep." If we are not "sheep of Jesus," faith does not some to us. It is a rosewater faith, a faith without substance. And let us think of the consolation that Barnabas felt, which is "the sweet and comforting joy of evangelizing." And let us ask the Lord for this "parresia", this apostolic fervor that impels us to move forward, as brothers, all of us forward! Forward, bringing the name of Jesus in the bosom of Holy Mother Church, and, as St. Ignatius said, "hierarchical and Catholic." So be it.
http://www.news.va/en/news/pope-mass-on-feast-of-st-george-full-text

WEDNESDAY, MAY 1, 2013
Pope Francis’ feast of St.George statement contradicts the Pontifical Council for Christian Unity
http://eucharistandmission.blogspot.it/2013/05/pope-francis-feast-of-stgeorge.html#links

Lionel A

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Re: Pope Francis contradicts the Vatican Congregation for the Clergy

Post by Admin on Sat May 04, 2013 4:10 pm

Lionel,

Father Feeney died in full communion with Rome and received a Mass of Christian Burial from his bishop. The 1949 Holy Office Letter, while authoritative, is not dogmatically so, as a few communities of Father Feeney were reconciled to the Catholic Church with only "an understanding" of it. Besides, the 1949 Holy Office Letter declares:

Now, among those things which the Church has always preached and will never cease to preach is contained also that infallible statement by which we are taught that there is no salvation outside the Church.

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